Customer Friendlier Boost Installation -- (Finally) Getting Started
Hi, I voluteered to look at how to make the "Getting Started" section of the homepage a bit easier to understand and follow. (Reminder: I failed to install boost on Windows due to stupid errors on my side which I claimed could have been avoided with an easier guide.) My time to do this is very limited, which is why this takes so long. Sorry, but I can't help it. I attached a zipped archive of what I have so far. (Unpack onto the "more" folder.) I threw this at some fellow workers being used to work with Windows. This gave some feedback of where I failed. Also, Dave has already put a lot of work into reviewing it and this brought many improvements. As I still don't understand Boost.Build (I consider it very important to remain as ignorant as the targeted audience while working on this guide. :o> ), I'd like this to first be reviewed here instead of just checking it in. One questions that I still have: When I tried to install boost, I had no idea what a toolset is, which acounts for some of my problems. My idea of this is still a bit foggy, but I think a definition at first use is in order. So what is a toolset? 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"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
Hi,
I voluteered to look at how to make the "Getting Started" section of the homepage a bit easier to understand and follow. (Reminder: I failed to install boost on Windows due to stupid errors on my side which I claimed could have been avoided with an easier guide.) My time to do this is very limited, which is why this takes so long. Sorry, but I can't help it. I attached a zipped archive of what I have so far. (Unpack onto the "more" folder.) I threw this at some fellow workers being used to work with Windows. This gave some feedback of where I failed. Also, Dave has already put a lot of work into reviewing it and this brought many improvements. As I still don't understand Boost.Build (I consider it very important to remain as ignorant as the targeted audience while working on this guide. :o> ), I'd like this to first be reviewed here instead of just checking it in.
One questions that I still have: When I tried to install boost, I had no idea what a toolset is, which acounts for some of my problems. My idea of this is still a bit foggy, but I think a definition at first use is in order. So what is a toolset?
Heh. Well in the real world it's a set of related executables and support files (like libraries, headers, etc.) that is designed to work cooperatively in executing steps of a build process. Thus you might have a toolset consisting of a c/c++ compiler and a linker that creates executables and dynamic libraries and an archiver that creates static libraries, and a set of standard library headers and runtime libraries. Another toolset might be the TeX/LaTeX suite of tools (including e.g. pdftex) and the associated TeX libraries for generating tables, doing particular layout styles, supporting unicode, etc. In Boost.Build there is a toolset abstraction that is designed to help the user: a. Tell Boost.Build how the toolset has been installed. In BBv1 it is done by setting variables in the environment or on the bjam command-line with -sVARIABLENAME=..., as documented on the pages for the individual toolsets. In BBv2 it's done in the user-config.jam and/or site-config.jam file. b. Configure the way the actual toolset is used by Boost.Build (same methods as above). c. Control options for building a target without knowing the toolset's specific command-line usage. It does that by translating build properties like <runtime-link>static into command-line flags and options. You should be able to use this text verbatim (or nearly so) in your document. HTH, -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
Hi,
I voluteered to look at how to make the "Getting Started" section of the homepage a bit easier to understand and follow. (Reminder: I failed to install boost on Windows due to stupid errors on my side which I claimed could have been avoided with an easier guide.) My time to do this is very limited, which is why this takes so long. Sorry, but I can't help it. I attached a zipped archive of what I have so far. (Unpack onto the "more" folder.) I threw this at some fellow workers being used to work with Windows. This gave some feedback of where I failed. Also, Dave has already put a lot of work into reviewing it and this brought many improvements. As I still don't understand Boost.Build (I consider it very important to remain as ignorant as the targeted audience while working on this guide. :o> ), I'd like this to first be reviewed here instead of just checking it in.
What do we tell people who get a Boost package for their linux system that was created by some package maintainer? We don't know much about where things are located in that case, or even which parts of the Boost tree the packager decided to include. At the very least, we need to provide a disclaimer that says "we don't know how to help you in that case." I'd like to do better, though. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
Hi,
I voluteered to look at how to make the "Getting Started" section of the homepage a bit easier to understand and follow. (Reminder: I failed to install boost on Windows due to stupid errors on my side which I claimed could have been avoided with an easier guide.) My time to do this is very limited, which is why this takes so long. Sorry, but I can't help it. I attached a zipped archive of what I have so far. (Unpack onto the "more" folder.) I threw this at some fellow workers being used to work with Windows. This gave some feedback of where I failed. Also, Dave has already put a lot of work into reviewing it and this brought many improvements. As I still don't understand Boost.Build (I consider it very important to remain as ignorant as the targeted audience while working on this guide. :o> ), I'd like this to first be reviewed here instead of just checking it in.
The "moderators" link is dead; it could point to mailto:boost-owner@lists.boost.org -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
Hi,
I voluteered to look at how to make the "Getting Started" section of the homepage a bit easier to understand and follow. (Reminder: I failed to install boost on Windows due to stupid errors on my side which I claimed could have been avoided with an easier guide.) My time to do this is very limited, which is why this takes so long. Sorry, but I can't help it. I attached a zipped archive of what I have so far. (Unpack onto the "more" folder.) I threw this at some fellow workers being used to work with Windows. This gave some feedback of where I failed. Also, Dave has already put a lot of work into reviewing it and this brought many improvements. As I still don't understand Boost.Build (I consider it very important to remain as ignorant as the targeted audience while working on this guide. :o> ), I'd like this to first be reviewed here instead of just checking it in.
If you are on a more common platform, it is strongly recommended that you download a prebuilt bjam executable here. Otherwise, or if you are using an unreleased state from CVS (or if you are feeling adventurous), you need to download its sources and build it yourself. should be: It is strongly recommended that you simply <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform. Otherwise, you'll need to build bjam from source. You may also need to rebuild bjam if you are using an unreleased state of the Boost sources from CVS, since the prebuilt executable may not support all the features currently being used by Boost. [no need to separately download the bjam sources -- they are checked into Boost's CVS!] [Levity is nice, but in this case there's real information we need to fit in. "use fewer words" - E.B. White] -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
If you are on a more common platform, it is strongly recommended that you download a prebuilt bjam executable here. Otherwise, or if you are using an unreleased state from CVS (or if you are feeling adventurous), you need to download its sources and build it yourself.
should be:
It is strongly recommended that you simply <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform. Otherwise, you'll need to build bjam from source. You may also need to rebuild bjam if you are using an unreleased state of the Boost sources from CVS, since the prebuilt executable may not support all the features currently being used by Boost.
Consider avoiding the passive "it is strongly recommended." I suggest this: You should <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform.... -- Rob Stewart stewart@sig.com Software Engineer http://www.sig.com Susquehanna International Group, LLP using std::disclaimer;
Rob Stewart wrote:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
should be:
It is strongly recommended that you simply <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform. Otherwise, you'll need to build bjam from source. You may also need to rebuild bjam if you are using an unreleased state of the Boost sources from CVS, since the prebuilt executable may not support all the features currently being used by Boost.
Consider avoiding the passive "it is strongly recommended." I suggest this:
You should <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform....
Or similarly to something that changes the meaning less: We strongly recommend that you simply <a href="...">download a [etc.] -- -- Grafik - Don't Assume Anything -- Redshift Software, Inc. - http://redshift-software.com -- rrivera/acm.org - grafik/redshift-software.com -- 102708583/icq - grafikrobot/aim - Grafik/jabber.org
From: Rene Rivera <grafik.list@redshift-software.com>
Rob Stewart wrote:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
should be:
It is strongly recommended that you simply <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform. Otherwise, you'll need to build bjam from source. You may also need to rebuild bjam if you are using an unreleased state of the Boost sources from CVS, since the prebuilt executable may not support all the features currently being used by Boost.
Consider avoiding the passive "it is strongly recommended." I suggest this:
You should <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform....
Or similarly to something that changes the meaning less:
We strongly recommend that you simply <a href="...">download a [etc.]
I don't see that mine changed the meaning. Sure, I omitted "strongly recommend," but this is a Getting Started guide, so anything not equivocated should be taken as explicit direction. Only the reader with enough familiarity to not require the Getting Started guide will know enough to choose another course. Also, I suspect -- I haven't confirmed this -- that "we" isn't used elsewhere. Thus, I think your version would need to be "Boost strongly recommends...." -- Rob Stewart stewart@sig.com Software Engineer http://www.sig.com Susquehanna International Group, LLP using std::disclaimer;
Rob Stewart wrote:
From: Rene Rivera <grafik.list@redshift-software.com>
Rob Stewart wrote:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
should be:
It is strongly recommended that you simply <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform. Otherwise, you'll need to build bjam from source. You may also need to rebuild bjam if you are using an unreleased state of the Boost sources from CVS, since the prebuilt executable may not support all the features currently being used by Boost.
Consider avoiding the passive "it is strongly recommended." I suggest this:
You should <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform....
Or similarly to something that changes the meaning less:
We strongly recommend that you simply <a href="...">download a [etc.]
I don't see that mine changed the meaning. Sure, I omitted "strongly recommend," but this is a Getting Started guide, so anything not equivocated should be taken as explicit direction. Only the reader with enough familiarity to not require the Getting Started guide will know enough to choose another course.
Sure :-) I was just pointing out the different, although subtle, change in tone of the statement.
Also, I suspect -- I haven't confirmed this -- that "we" isn't used elsewhere. Thus, I think your version would need to be "Boost strongly recommends...."
That's funny ;-) Given that the same sentence we are talking about has "... if _we_ have supplied ...". -- -- Grafik - Don't Assume Anything -- Redshift Software, Inc. - http://redshift-software.com -- rrivera/acm.org - grafik/redshift-software.com -- 102708583/icq - grafikrobot/aim - Grafik/jabber.org
Rene Rivera <grafik.list@redshift-software.com> writes:
Rob Stewart wrote:
From: Rene Rivera <grafik.list@redshift-software.com>
Rob Stewart wrote:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
should be:
It is strongly recommended that you simply <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform. Otherwise, you'll need to build bjam from source. You may also need to rebuild bjam if you are using an unreleased state of the Boost sources from CVS, since the prebuilt executable may not support all the features currently being used by Boost.
Consider avoiding the passive "it is strongly recommended." I suggest this:
You should <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform....
Or similarly to something that changes the meaning less:
We strongly recommend that you simply <a href="...">download a [etc.]
I don't see that mine changed the meaning. Sure, I omitted "strongly recommend," but this is a Getting Started guide, so anything not equivocated should be taken as explicit direction. Only the reader with enough familiarity to not require the Getting Started guide will know enough to choose another course.
Sure :-) I was just pointing out the different, although subtle, change in tone of the statement.
I don't think it's that subtle. First of all, the reader is about to readq some text telling them that under some circumstances they may need to build bjam, and they are likely to think, "oh, well I'll just rebuild it to be safe." More importantly, we used to not say "strongly recommend" and we ended up with lots of newbies who should have been downloading a prebuilt trying to build their own. I put that language and the associated formatting in there for a practical reason; please don't fix what ain't broke. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
From: Rene Rivera <grafik.list@redshift-software.com>
Rob Stewart wrote:
From: Rene Rivera <grafik.list@redshift-software.com>
Rob Stewart wrote:
Consider avoiding the passive "it is strongly recommended." I suggest this:
You should <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform....
Or similarly to something that changes the meaning less:
We strongly recommend that you simply <a href="...">download a [etc.]
I don't see that mine changed the meaning. Sure, I omitted "strongly recommend," but this is a Getting Started guide, so anything not equivocated should be taken as explicit direction. Only the reader with enough familiarity to not require the Getting Started guide will know enough to choose another course.
Sure :-) I was just pointing out the different, although subtle, change in tone of the statement.
OK
Also, I suspect -- I haven't confirmed this -- that "we" isn't used elsewhere. Thus, I think your version would need to be "Boost strongly recommends...."
That's funny ;-) Given that the same sentence we are talking about has "... if _we_ have supplied ...".
Doh! I told you I hadn't confirmed it! -- Rob Stewart stewart@sig.com Software Engineer http://www.sig.com Susquehanna International Group, LLP using std::disclaimer;
I've come back from holiday to catch up on this discussion. Since I was one of original complainants, I'd like to say: 1 Thanks for work on this - definitely improved. 2 I don't think it would hurt to offer examples for most items, mostly Windows as they are less clued up than *nixers, for example, suggest download to a convenient temporary location, for example c:\temp. 3 You have wisely provided a way to work if you only want to use header files, allow a skip to Add the Boost root directory to the compiler's #include <...> path But this means you need to recommend a location for unpacking boost, outside bjam. So add "Unpack the downloaded package to a Boost root directory, for example, c:\boost for Win32 or /usr/local for *nix." 3 The Windows tools/options/ should mention the include (and later the library) path dropdown, and say if the order of includes in important (I put it first - but is that best, or doesn't it matter?). 4 You don't mention VC8 - soon to be widely used. 5 It would be helpful to replace all reference to previous versions to 1_33. 6 The revision dates need updating. Thanks Paul Paul A Bristow Prizet Farmhouse, Kendal, Cumbria UK LA8 8AB +44 1539 561830 +44 7714 330204 mailto: pbristow@hetp.u-net.com | -----Original Message----- | From: boost-bounces@lists.boost.org | [mailto:boost-bounces@lists.boost.org] On Behalf Of Rob Stewart | Sent: 21 June 2005 21:04 | To: boost@lists.boost.org | Cc: boost@lists.boost.org | Subject: Re: [boost] Customer Friendlier Boost Installation | -- (Finally) Getting Started
"Paul A Bristow" <pbristow@hetp.u-net.com> writes:
Add the Boost root directory to the compiler's #include <...> path
But this means you need to recommend a location for unpacking boost, outside bjam.
So add "Unpack the downloaded package to a Boost root directory, for example, c:\boost for Win32 or /usr/local for *nix."
Those particular directions will at best cause confusion because the archive has a top-level directory called boost_1_33_0 that is the Boost root directory. People will end up with c:\boost\boost_1_33_0 and think that c:\boost is the Boost root. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
Well I suspect I am not the only one confused already ;-) (I did claim to be well qualified!) A definition of 'Boost root' seems useful, for a start, even if it seems obvious to you. The table of bjam options appears to me to provide c:\boost as the Win32 default for where bjam puts the Boost version files. How do you suggest switching to a new Boost version 1.34? And back again if it proves to cause trouble :-( Are you suggesting having c:\boost_1_33_0 and c:\boost_1_34_0 ... ? (c:\boost_1_33_latestCVS?) Victor Wagner posted a method using an environment variable which worked well for him, allowing a smooth switch to and from release versions. should we suggest this? Paul PS You might reduce resistance to using bjam by saying a bit more explicitly what it does "bjam runs the compiler and linker externally to any IDE..." It may come to a surprise to some Windows programmers that it is possible to run the compiler outside the IDE. And 'define' a toolset (compiler & linker etc)? Paul A Bristow Prizet Farmhouse, Kendal, Cumbria UK LA8 8AB +44 1539 561830 +44 7714 330204 mailto: pbristow@hetp.u-net.com | -----Original Message----- | From: boost-bounces@lists.boost.org | [mailto:boost-bounces@lists.boost.org] On Behalf Of David Abrahams | Sent: 04 July 2005 22:07 | To: boost@lists.boost.org | Subject: Re: [boost] Customer Friendlier Boost Installation | -- (Finally)Getting Started | | "Paul A Bristow" <pbristow@hetp.u-net.com> writes: | | > Add the Boost root directory to the compiler's #include <...> path | > | > But this means you need to recommend a location for | unpacking boost, outside | > bjam. | > | > So add "Unpack the downloaded package to a Boost root directory, for | > example, c:\boost for Win32 or /usr/local for *nix." | | Those particular directions will at best cause confusion because the | archive has a top-level directory called boost_1_33_0 that is the | Boost root directory. People will end up with c:\boost\boost_1_33_0 | and think that c:\boost is the Boost root. | | -- | Dave Abrahams | Boost Consulting | www.boost-consulting.com | | _______________________________________________ | Unsubscribe & other changes: | http://lists.boost.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/boost |
Paul A Bristow wrote:
Well I suspect I am not the only one confused already ;-)
(I did claim to be well qualified!)
A definition of 'Boost root' seems useful, for a start, even if it seems obvious to you.
The table of bjam options appears to me to provide c:\boost as the Win32 default for where bjam puts the Boost version files.
How do you suggest switching to a new Boost version 1.34? And back again if it proves to cause trouble :-(
The "bjam install" is designed so that it *does not* collide across versions. So there is no need to change the installation location for new versions. -- -- Grafik - Don't Assume Anything -- Redshift Software, Inc. - http://redshift-software.com -- rrivera/acm.org - grafik/redshift-software.com -- 102708583/icq - grafikrobot/aim - Grafik/jabber.org
Rene Rivera wrote:
Paul A Bristow wrote:
Well I suspect I am not the only one confused already ;-)
(I did claim to be well qualified!)
A definition of 'Boost root' seems useful, for a start, even if it seems obvious to you.
The table of bjam options appears to me to provide c:\boost as the Win32 default for where bjam puts the Boost version files.
How do you suggest switching to a new Boost version 1.34? And back again if it proves to cause trouble :-(
The "bjam install" is designed so that it *does not* collide across versions. So there is no need to change the installation location for new versions.
Bjam install doesn't copy headers. Headers will cause problems. Remember our discussion some time ago. I proposed the following structure: /dev/libs/libboost* /dev/boost_1_31/boost/*.hpp Which will allow to install multiple libraries (not only boost) into the same tree, if all libraries follow Boost naming conventions. Andrey
Andrey Melnikov wrote:
Rene Rivera wrote:
The "bjam install" is designed so that it *does not* collide across versions. So there is no need to change the installation location for new versions.
Bjam install doesn't copy headers. Headers will cause problems.
Well the current, BBv1, one does copy the headers. And it avoids collisions by installing to this structure: [root]/libs/libboost*1_33.* [root]/include/boost_1_33/boost/*.hpp
Remember our discussion some time ago. I proposed the following structure:
/dev/libs/libboost* /dev/boost_1_31/boost/*.hpp
Which will allow to install multiple libraries (not only boost) into the same tree, if all libraries follow Boost naming conventions.
Truth is I don't remember, or I missed it in all my server problems :-) But yes picking a generic top level directory on Windows, instead of "Boost", is a good idea. Although I'd prefer to keep the structure below that as it currently is. This is to keep it in line with what it does on non-Windows platforms. It's hard enough to explain all this once, doing it for each platform if they are different is just plain PITA. -- -- Grafik - Don't Assume Anything -- Redshift Software, Inc. - http://redshift-software.com -- rrivera/acm.org - grafik/redshift-software.com -- 102708583/icq - grafikrobot/aim - Grafik/jabber.org
"Paul A Bristow" <pbristow@hetp.u-net.com> writes:
Well I suspect I am not the only one confused already ;-)
(I did claim to be well qualified!)
A definition of 'Boost root' seems useful, for a start, even if it seems obvious to you.
It doesn't seem obvious to me, and if you read through my replies in this thread you will see that I suggested specific text that indicates which directory it is.
The table of bjam options appears to me to provide c:\boost as the Win32 default for where bjam puts the Boost version files.
How do you suggest switching to a new Boost version 1.34? And back again if it proves to cause trouble :-(
I don't understand the question.
Are you suggesting having c:\boost_1_33_0 and c:\boost_1_34_0 ... ? (c:\boost_1_33_latestCVS?)
No, but that seems like a reasonable approach. The specific path is up to you. I might use: c:\boost\1.33.0\ c:\boost\1.34.0\ c:\boost\cvs\
Victor Wagner posted a method using an environment variable which worked well for him, allowing a smooth switch to and from release versions. should we suggest this?
I don't like to recommend anything that requires an environment variable to be set up.
Paul
PS You might reduce resistance to using bjam by saying a bit more explicitly what it does
"bjam runs the compiler and linker externally to any IDE..."
That's a good idea.
It may come to a surprise to some Windows programmers that it is possible to run the compiler outside the IDE.
Very true :)
And 'define' a toolset (compiler & linker etc)?
Also a good idea. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
David Abrahams wrote:
"Paul A Bristow" <pbristow@hetp.u-net.com> writes:
Well I suspect I am not the only one confused already ;-)
(I did claim to be well qualified!)
A definition of 'Boost root' seems useful, for a start, even if it seems obvious to you.
It doesn't seem obvious to me, and if you read through my replies in this thread you will see that I suggested specific text that indicates which directory it is.
The table of bjam options appears to me to provide c:\boost as the Win32 default for where bjam puts the Boost version files.
How do you suggest switching to a new Boost version 1.34? And back again if it proves to cause trouble :-(
I don't understand the question.
The question was: How do you suggest to have multiple boost versions installed side by side?
Are you suggesting having c:\boost_1_33_0 and c:\boost_1_34_0 ... ? (c:\boost_1_33_latestCVS?)
No, but that seems like a reasonable approach. The specific path is up to you. I might use:
c:\boost\1.33.0\ c:\boost\1.34.0\ c:\boost\cvs\
Victor Wagner posted a method using an environment variable which worked well for him, allowing a smooth switch to and from release versions. should we suggest this?
I don't like to recommend anything that requires an environment variable to be set up.
I don't like either. You may need to switch currently used version frequently. Environment variables aren't suited for frequent changes. I'd recommend to set appropriate header search path in your projects. And if you use boost.build v2, you should have multiple versions of boost //site-config/boost-1_33 etc configured in your site-config.
PS You might reduce resistance to using bjam by saying a bit more explicitly what it does
"bjam runs the compiler and linker externally to any IDE..."
That's a good idea.
It may come to a surprise to some Windows programmers that it is possible to run the compiler outside the IDE.
Very true :)
And 'define' a toolset (compiler & linker etc)?
Also a good idea.
Who is going to contribute? I'd like to, but I don't like where should I put this guide. Maybe we should put it into bbv2 docs, because updating bbv1 docs is a waste of time due to migration to bbv1. Do you think that indeed we have to update bbv1 docs too?
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
"Paul A Bristow" <pbristow@hetp.u-net.com> writes:
Well I suspect I am not the only one confused already ;-)
(I did claim to be well qualified!)
A definition of 'Boost root' seems useful, for a start, even if it seems obvious to you.
It doesn't seem obvious to me, and if you read through my replies in this thread you will see that I suggested specific text that indicates which directory it is.
The table of bjam options appears to me to provide c:\boost as the Win32 default for where bjam puts the Boost version files.
How do you suggest switching to a new Boost version 1.34? And back again if it proves to cause trouble :-(
I don't understand the question.
The question was: How do you suggest to have multiple boost versions installed side by side?
No, it wasn't. I can read the exact question above. But I still don't understand it.
Who is going to contribute? I'd like to, but I don't like where should I put this guide.
I think you should work with Schobi, who is rewriting the Getting Started guide.
Maybe we should put it into bbv2 docs, because updating bbv1 docs is a waste of time due to migration to bbv1. Do you think that indeed we have to update bbv1 docs too?
We need to update the getting started guide. Changing it to refer to BBv2 when we make the switch will be trivial. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
Rene Rivera <grafik.list@redshift-software.com> writes:
Rob Stewart wrote:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
should be:
It is strongly recommended that you simply <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform. Otherwise, you'll need to build bjam from source. You may also need to rebuild bjam if you are using an unreleased state of the Boost sources from CVS, since the prebuilt executable may not support all the features currently being used by Boost.
Consider avoiding the passive "it is strongly recommended." I suggest this:
You should <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform....
Or similarly to something that changes the meaning less:
We strongly recommend that you simply <a href="...">download a [etc.]
Each one is an improvement on the one before it! -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
David Abrahams wrote:
Rene Rivera <grafik.list@redshift-software.com> writes:
Rob Stewart wrote:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
should be:
It is strongly recommended that you simply <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform. Otherwise, you'll need to build bjam from source. You may also need to rebuild bjam if you are using an unreleased state of the Boost sources from CVS, since the prebuilt executable may not support all the features currently being used by Boost.
Consider avoiding the passive "it is strongly recommended." I suggest this:
You should <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform....
Or similarly to something that changes the meaning less:
We strongly recommend that you simply <a href="...">download a [etc.]
Each one is an improvement on the one before it!
---- It is strongly recommended that you simply download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform: - <a>windows</a> - <a>linux</a> - <a>freebsd</a> - <a>solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS X</a> If we haven't supplied one for your platform, you'll need to build bjam from source as described in <a>installation guide</a> by running build.bat or build.sh. You may also need to <a>rebuild bjam</a> if you are using an unreleased state of the Boost sources from CVS, since the prebuilt executable may not support all the features currently being used by Boost. ----- This will save a lot of time by avoiding extra lookup. Some people may just search for build.bat and run it without looking at the doc hoping that it will work out of the box (and in 99% of cases on Windows it really will). Who is actually going to check this in? Andrey
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
Rene Rivera <grafik.list@redshift-software.com> writes:
Consider avoiding the passive "it is strongly recommended." I ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ suggest this:
You should <a href="...">download a prebuilt bjam executable</a> if we have supplied one for your platform....
Or similarly to something that changes the meaning less:
We strongly recommend that you simply <a href="...">download a [etc.]
Each one is an improvement on the one before it!
---- It is strongly recommended that you simply download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform:
Avoid the passive voice. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
David Abrahams wrote:
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
---- It is strongly recommended that you simply download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform:
Avoid the passive voice.
I just quoted a wrong place.. Look at this variant. I changed a lot. ---- We compiled a version of bjam executable (bjam.exe or bjam) for you, and tested it with Boost release. We strongly recommend you simply to download prebuilt bjam for your platform: - <a>windows</a> - <a>linux</a> - <a>freebsd</a> - <a>solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS X</a> If your platform isn't in the list, or if you downloaded the latest Boost beta sources from CVS instead of official Boost release, <a>installation guide</a> describes how to compile bjam from sources located in tools/build/jam_src by running build.bat or build.sh. Latest Boost sources may fail to compile with prebuilt bjam because prebuilt version could become incompatible with Boost *.jam files. ----- Andrey
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
---- It is strongly recommended that you simply download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform:
Avoid the passive voice.
I just quoted a wrong place.. Look at this variant. I changed a lot.
---- We compiled a version of bjam executable (bjam.exe or bjam) for you, and tested it with Boost release. We strongly recommend you simply to download prebuilt bjam for your platform: - <a>windows</a> - <a>linux</a> - <a>freebsd</a> - <a>solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS X</a>
If your platform isn't in the list, or if you downloaded the latest Boost beta sources from CVS instead of official Boost release, <a>installation guide</a> describes how to compile bjam from sources located in tools/build/jam_src by running build.bat or build.sh.
Latest Boost sources may fail to compile with prebuilt bjam because prebuilt version could become incompatible with Boost *.jam files. -----
You are missing a bunch of articles, and personally, I don't like the style of "We compiled ... for you." It seems that it would better to say that using the prebuilt bjam executable, if there is one available, -- Jeremy Maitin-Shepard
Jeremy Maitin-Shepard wrote:
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
---- We compiled a version of bjam executable (bjam.exe or bjam) for you, and tested it with Boost release. We strongly recommend you simply to download prebuilt bjam for your platform: - <a>windows</a> - <a>linux</a> - <a>freebsd</a> - <a>solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS X</a>
If your platform isn't in the list, or if you downloaded the latest Boost beta sources from CVS instead of official Boost release, <a>installation guide</a> describes how to compile bjam from sources located in tools/build/jam_src by running build.bat or build.sh.
Latest Boost sources may fail to compile with prebuilt bjam because prebuilt version could become incompatible with Boost *.jam files. -----
You are missing a bunch of articles, and personally, I don't like the style of "We compiled ... for you." It seems that it would better to say that using the prebuilt bjam executable, if there is one available,
Why don't you fix it then? :) English isn't my native language, and my English grammar isn't perfect. Anfrey.
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
You are missing a bunch of articles, and personally, I don't like the style of "We compiled ... for you." It seems that it would better to say that using the prebuilt bjam executable, if there is one available,
Why don't you fix it then? :) English isn't my native language, and my English grammar isn't perfect.
One might ask whether your suggestion, overall, is making work for people who need to fix it up or saving work for those who need to arrive at workable text for the guide. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
David Abrahams wrote:
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
You are missing a bunch of articles, and personally, I don't like the style of "We compiled ... for you." It seems that it would better to say that using the prebuilt bjam executable, if there is one available,
Why don't you fix it then? :) English isn't my native language, and my English grammar isn't perfect.
One might ask whether your suggestion, overall, is making work for people who need to fix it up or saving work for those who need to arrive at workable text for the guide.
I'm just doing my best. If I could fix the grammar myself, I would. I hope that fixing minor grammatical mistakes is much easier than writing manuals. It's better to write docs with slightly bad grammar than not to write them at all. Am I wrong? Andrey
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
---- It is strongly recommended that you simply download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform:
Avoid the passive voice.
I just quoted a wrong place.. Look at this variant. I changed a lot.
---- We compiled a version of bjam executable (bjam.exe or bjam) for you, and tested it with Boost release.
You can't say that, because it might not be true. There are platforms for which we didn't do that. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
David Abrahams wrote:
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
---- It is strongly recommended that you simply download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform:
Avoid the passive voice.
I just quoted a wrong place.. Look at this variant. I changed a lot.
---- We compiled a version of bjam executable (bjam.exe or bjam) for you, and tested it with Boost release.
You can't say that, because it might not be true. There are platforms for which we didn't do that.
We didn't compile, or we didn't test? The idea of "tested" clause was to convince users that they don't need to build bjam themselves if there is a precompiled version. If we didn't compile, I think we can live with this, because later we tell people what to do if the platform isn't in the list. Andrey
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
---- It is strongly recommended that you simply download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform:
Avoid the passive voice.
I just quoted a wrong place.. Look at this variant. I changed a lot.
---- We compiled a version of bjam executable (bjam.exe or bjam) for you, and tested it with Boost release.
You can't say that, because it might not be true. There are platforms for which we didn't do that.
We didn't compile, or we didn't test?
Either one. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
From: Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com>
We compiled a version of bjam executable (bjam.exe or bjam) for you, and tested it with Boost release. We strongly recommend you simply to download prebuilt bjam for your platform: - <a>windows</a> - <a>linux</a> - <a>freebsd</a> - <a>solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS X</a>
If your platform isn't in the list, or if you downloaded the latest Boost beta sources from CVS instead of official Boost release, <a>installation guide</a> describes how to compile bjam from sources located in tools/build/jam_src by running build.bat or build.sh.
Latest Boost sources may fail to compile with prebuilt bjam because prebuilt version could become incompatible with Boost *.jam files.
We strongly recommend that you download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform. If your platform isn't in the following list, or if you downloaded the latest Boost sources from CVS instead of getting an official release, <a>installation guide</a> describes how to build bjam for yourself. - <a>Windows</a> - <a>Linux</a> - <a>FreeBSD</a> - <a>Solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS</a> (I'd leave the rest of the details to <a>installation guide</a>.) -- Rob Stewart stewart@sig.com Software Engineer http://www.sig.com Susquehanna International Group, LLP using std::disclaimer;
Rob Stewart wrote:
We strongly recommend that you download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform. If your platform isn't in the following list, or if you downloaded the latest Boost sources from CVS instead of getting an official release, <a>installation guide</a> describes how to build bjam for yourself.
- <a>Windows</a> - <a>Linux</a> - <a>FreeBSD</a> - <a>Solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS</a>
(I'd leave the rest of the details to <a>installation guide</a>.)
Much better. My notes: The binaries will work only with the same Boost version. It's possible that Boost 1.32 will fail to compile with Bjam from later versions. So here is the next version: If you downloaded Boost 1.33 release, download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform. - <a>Windows</a> - <a>Linux</a> - <a>FreeBSD</a> - <a>Solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS</a> If you downloaded the latest Boost sources from CVS, or if your platform isn't listed, <a>installation guide</a> describes how to build bjam yourself. Andrey
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
Rob Stewart wrote:
We strongly recommend that you download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform. If your platform isn't in the following list, or if you downloaded the latest Boost sources from CVS instead of getting an official release, <a>installation guide</a> describes how to build bjam for yourself.
- <a>Windows</a> - <a>Linux</a> - <a>FreeBSD</a> - <a>Solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS</a>
(I'd leave the rest of the details to <a>installation guide</a>.)
Much better.
My notes:
The binaries will work only with the same Boost version. It's possible that Boost 1.32 will fail to compile with Bjam from later versions.
That's highly unlikely. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
From: Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com>
Rob Stewart wrote: [snipped my version] Much better.
Thanks.
The binaries will work only with the same Boost version. It's possible that Boost 1.32 will fail to compile with Bjam from later versions.
OK.
So here is the next version:
If you downloaded Boost 1.33 release, download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform.
- <a>Windows</a> - <a>Linux</a> - <a>FreeBSD</a> - <a>Solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS</a>
If you downloaded the latest Boost sources from CVS, or if your platform isn't listed, <a>installation guide</a> describes how to build bjam yourself.
That misses an important structural aspect I put in mine: don't say to get a prebuilt executable and show the list before you give the exception. I also think it is important to compare the CVS download to getting an official release. The latter suggests to the reader that there are other official releases to be found which can be downloaded instead of the latest. So, here's my version: We strongly recommend that you download a prebuilt bjam executable for your platform and version of Boost. If your platform isn't in the following list, or if you downloaded the latest Boost sources from CVS instead of getting an official release, <a>installation guide</a> describes how to build bjam for yourself. Here are the prebuilt bjam executables for the Boost 1.33 release: - <a>Windows</a> - <a>Linux</a> - <a>FreeBSD</a> - <a>Solaris</a> - <a>Mac OS</a> To avoid having to change the text for each release, you could replace "the Boost 1.33 release" with "the latest Boost release." -- Rob Stewart stewart@sig.com Software Engineer http://www.sig.com Susquehanna International Group, LLP using std::disclaimer;
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
Hi,
I voluteered to look at how to make the "Getting Started" section of the homepage a bit easier to understand and follow. (Reminder: I failed to install boost on Windows due to stupid errors on my side which I claimed could have been avoided with an easier guide.) My time to do this is very limited, which is why this takes so long. Sorry, but I can't help it. I attached a zipped archive of what I have so far. (Unpack onto the "more" folder.) I threw this at some fellow workers being used to work with Windows. This gave some feedback of where I failed. Also, Dave has already put a lot of work into reviewing it and this brought many improvements. As I still don't understand Boost.Build (I consider it very important to remain as ignorant as the targeted audience while working on this guide. :o> ), I'd like this to first be reviewed here instead of just checking it in.
I'd like to see the individual steps more clearly delineated. For example, instead of Download The Boost Libraries are distributed through the SourceForge file distribution system. Click here to download releases from SourceForge. The Boost release includes all of the libraries and other material from the web site. It is available in ZIP, TAR.GZ, and TAR.BZ2 formats. Past releases are also available. Unpack the release to a convenient location. It is also possible to download current snapshots of work-in-progress from Boost's CVS repository. I'd rather see Download * We recommend working with an official release of Boost. 1. Click here to download releases from SourceForge. The Boost release includes all of the libraries and other material from the web site. It is available in ZIP, TAR.GZ, and TAR.BZ2 formats. Past releases are also available. 2. Unpack the release to a convenient location. * You can also download current snapshots of work-in-progress from Boost's CVS repository. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
I'd like this to first be reviewed here instead of just checking it in.
I wish Thunderbird could understand the uuencode inline (non-attachment) in the email.. Could someone post a MIME attachment version. David Abrahams wrote:
I'd rather see
Download
* We recommend working with an official release of Boost.
1. Click here to download releases from SourceForge.
WAI web accessibility rules/guidelines say that having "click here" links are bad for a variety of reasons. So something like this would be better: 1. <a href="...">Download</a> releases from SourceForge. They also say that no two links should have the same text. So if there is another "Download" link in the page on might have to do this: 1. <a href="...">Download Boost releases</a> from SourceForge.
The Boost release includes all of the libraries and other material from the web site. It is available in ZIP, TAR.GZ, and TAR.BZ2 formats. Past releases are also available.
2. Unpack the release to a convenient location.
* You can also download current snapshots of work-in-progress from Boost's CVS repository.
And equivalently (I haven't see the real HTML so this is AFAIK): * You can also download current snapshots of work-in-progress from <a href="...">Boost's CVS repository</a>. -- -- Grafik - Don't Assume Anything -- Redshift Software, Inc. - http://redshift-software.com -- rrivera/acm.org - grafik/redshift-software.com -- 102708583/icq - grafikrobot/aim - Grafik/jabber.org
Rene Rivera <grafik.list@redshift-software.com> writes:
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
I'd like this to first be reviewed here instead of just checking it in.
I wish Thunderbird could understand the uuencode inline (non-attachment) in the email.. Could someone post a MIME attachment version.
Gnus has no trouble with it, but here you go: -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
David Abrahams wrote:
This body part will be downloaded on demand.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
This body part will be downloaded on demand.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Where I can find the last version? This version doesn't have program_options in the list on libraries which require building, and doesn't collect information from all 3 pages we have. I don't like to search for bugs in outdated products. Andrey
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
The Boost release includes all of the libraries and other material from the web site. It is available in ZIP, TAR.GZ, and TAR.BZ2 formats. Past releases are also available.
On *nix, those file formats are given by "zip," "tar.gz," and "tar.bz2" suffixes. On Windows, case doesn't matter. Therefore, I suggest using the lower case suffixes in the text. -- Rob Stewart stewart@sig.com Software Engineer http://www.sig.com Susquehanna International Group, LLP using std::disclaimer;
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> writes:
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
The Boost release includes all of the libraries and other material from the web site. It is available in ZIP, TAR.GZ, and TAR.BZ2 formats. Past releases are also available.
On *nix, those file formats are given by "zip," "tar.gz," and "tar.bz2" suffixes. On Windows, case doesn't matter. Therefore, I suggest using the lower case suffixes in the text.
That's an important thing to fix. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
As I still don't understand Boost.Build (I consider it very important to remain as ignorant as the targeted audience while working on this guide. :o> ), I'd like this to first be reviewed here instead of just checking it in.
Your reference to building bjam is ../tools/build/jam_src/index.html but it should be ../tools/build/jam_src/index.html#building_bjam And first you need to tell people that before following those instructions they need to be in the tools/build/jam_src subdirectory of their Boost installation. --- Okay, I remember rewriting this sentence for you: Most of Boost's libraries are header-only. I suggested: Most Boost libraries consist entirely of header files. --- The section entitled Add the Boost root directory to the compiler's #include <...> path should probably not start with the sentence Add the Boost root directory to the compiler's #include <...> path It's just a wee bit redundant :) --- I'm pretty sure I suggested this bit: If are used doing everything through an IDE, don't worry. The rest of these instructions will walk you through all the steps necessary. But I'm also pretty sure I wrote something more like "If _you_ are used _to_ doing..." What was my original wording? I think this part should go in a callout box. --- I'm pretty sure I made this point before: we should not mention building with multiple toolsets ("You can build the libraries for one or more toolsets"), especially without supplying any instructions on how to do it. The new user can just invoke bjam multiple times. If I didn't mention it, I thought it :) --- See here how you can tailor Boost.Build for your platform. and See here how to do this. are ungrammatical. Furthermore, the 1st "here" link doesn't point at information on tailoring Boost.Build for a particular platform. You should drop that sentence. Am I imagining things, or did I already make that point? And the 2nd "here" doesn't point at the information it claims either. Am I imagining things, or did I already make that point? To find out about variable settings, you need to click the name of the toolset in the table above. More information on how to use bjam can be found here. I honestly think it's a bad idea to point people to that document at this point in the getting started guide. It's just a distraction, and there's even some misleading information at the beginning of it. --- To prepare Unix tools such as GCC, the compiler and linker must be in your PATH. (Depending on your installation, a Unix compiler such as GCC may have additional requirements.) Many Unix operating systems come preconfigured and require no user intervention. (If you don't want to clutter your environment with settings or you have a nonstandard installations for some of the tools, you need to set variables which point to the toolset installation directories, either in the command shell environment or on the bjam command-line. See here how to do this. More information on how to use bjam can be found here.) Note: In US english, "which" can only be used in a phrase that could be removed from a sentence without changing its meaning, which means it's usually after a comma. Use "that" otherwise. Parenthesization: lay off the parens! If it's not important, leave it out, or at least push it down into a footnote. Also, having a paragraph break inside of parentheses is really too much! This should have been: To prepare Unix tools such as GCC, the compiler and linker must be in your PATH. [1] Many Unix operating systems come preconfigured and require no user intervention. If you don't want to clutter your environment with settings or if your toolset has a nonstandard installation, you may need to pass some configuration variables to bjam. Click the name of a toolset in the table above to learn more. --- You can still break up getting_started-build.html into more pages: * Select Libraries * Get the Build Tool * Select a Toolset * Select an Installation Directory * Build and Install (this includes "Configuring the Build") --- (If you don't build the Boost libraries, because you exclusively use the header-only libraries, the folder containing the downloaded Boost distribution will be your root directory.) Lay off the parens. You could just drop them. This sentence is important after all! Also drop the first comma. --- Boost root directory Okay, the information here is wrong; I must've led you astray because I've never done this installation thing before. Traditionally, at least, the Boost root directory (sometimes referred to as $BOOST_ROOT) is the parent of the directory called "boost/" that contains header files like "shared_ptr.hpp". In this case, it would be the directory called boost_1_32_0. So we should take the term "Boost root" out of this getting_started discussion entirely; it will just confound people. Instead, we can use the term "#include root." We don't want to tell people that they can let bjam use the defaults and move the directory structure later because on Unix, at least, there will probably be other things in /usr/local/include and /usr/local/lib that shouldn't be moved. I'm going to rewrite that whole section here, removing awkward/empty wording. Unindent to get reasonably-close-to-correct HTML <h1>Select an Installation Directory</h1> The installation process builds libraries and copies headers into the following directory structure: <pre> <i>installation directory</i> | +---include | | | +---boost-<i>version</i> <i>(e.g. boost-1_33/)</i> <b><== the #include root</b> | | | +---boost | | | +---<i>header1</i>.hpp | <i>header2</i>.hpp | . | . | . | <i>more headers and directories</i> | | +---lib | +---<i>library1</i> <i>library2</i> . . . </pre> The default installation directory is "/usr/local" on Unix systems and "C:\Boost" on Windows systems, but you can override that by passing <tt>--prefix=</tt><i>installation directory</i> on the <tt>bjam</tt> command line. <p> Note: the <b><code>#include</code> root</b> directory mentioned above will be added to your compiler's <code>#include</code> path in a later step. If you don't install the Boost libraries because you're exclusively using its header-only libraries, the folder containing the downloaded Boost distribution will act as your <code>#include</code> root directory. --- The default build and install attempts to build all available libraries and install to default locations the libraries and Boost header files. On Unix systems the default install location is "/usr/local", and on Windows systems the default is "C:\Boost". Within those directories libraries are installed to the "lib" subdirectory, and headers to an "include/boost-1_32" subdirectory, the version will reflect the distribution you are installing. This is really scary, after all the discussion of people not being happy with the default installation location, because you have already told people to go ahead and issue the commands that do the installation! Fortunately, all the important information went into the earlier section, so you can strike that paragraph. Just write If you need to change the installation directories or you want to tune other aspects of the build, see Configuring the Build. here, as you have done, and it will be perfect. --- Rename Add the Boost root directory to the compiler's #include <...> path to Tell the Compiler About the <code>#include</code> Root Directory Rewrite the contents accordingly. --- If you are using an IDE, refer to its documentation how to do this. It's a nit, but we went over this issue already: as a point of style, you can't use "this" without an antecedent, i.e. a noun after "this" that describes what this refers to, as in "how to do this job." But don't say that; it's awkward. I suggest you look for all instances of "this" and check your usage. Also, there's a preposition missing before "how." How about, If you are using an IDE, there is usually a graphical tool for specifying which directories will be searched for <code>#include<...></code>ed files. ?? --- Footnotes: [1] Depending on your installation, a Unix compiler such as GCC may have additional requirements. Check with your system administrator if you're unsure about your installation. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
See here how you can tailor Boost.Build for your platform. and See here how to do this.
are ungrammatical.
The first can be rewritten as, "You can <a href="...">tailor Boost.Build</a> for your platform," for example.
To prepare Unix tools such as GCC, the compiler and linker must be
Rather than "Unix" consider "*nix" to be more inclusive. Those using a *nix OS will understand. Those not using one won't care.
The installation process builds libraries and copies headers into the following directory structure:
<pre> <i>installation directory</i> | +---include | | | +---boost-<i>version</i> <i>(e.g. boost-1_33/)</i> <b><== the #include root</b> | | | +---boost | | | +---<i>header1</i>.hpp | <i>header2</i>.hpp | . | . | . | <i>more headers and directories</i> | | +---lib | +---<i>library1</i> <i>library2</i> . . .
</pre>
Very nice picture of the structure.
<p> Note: the <b><code>#include</code> root</b> directory mentioned
s/root/<i>root</i>
above will be added to your compiler's <code>#include</code> path in a later step. If you don't install the Boost libraries because you're exclusively using its header-only libraries, the folder containing the downloaded Boost distribution will act as your <code>#include</code> root directory.
Good. I was going to call for a footnote describing "#include root" better and relating it to the compiler's include path, but you've got it covered.
The default build and install attempts to build all available libraries and install to default locations the libraries and Boost header files.
Now you're sounding a bit like Yoda. How about this: The default build and install attempts to build all available libraries and install the libraries and header files to default locations.
Also, there's a preposition missing before "how." How about,
If you are using an IDE, there is usually a graphical tool for specifying which directories will be searched for <code>#include<...></code>ed files.
"Graphical tool" suggests something other than a dialog or other on-screen GUI structure to me. It suggests, e.g., charting. I suggest this: If you are using an IDE, it probably provides a means for specifying which directories will be searched for....
Footnotes: [1] Depending on your installation, a Unix compiler such as GCC may have additional requirements. Check with your system administrator if you're unsure about your installation.
While correct, "you're unsure" is a bit awkward. I suggest expanding the contraction or replacing "unsure" with "not sure." -- Rob Stewart stewart@sig.com Software Engineer http://www.sig.com Susquehanna International Group, LLP using std::disclaimer;
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> writes:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
See here how you can tailor Boost.Build for your platform. and See here how to do this.
are ungrammatical.
The first can be rewritten as, "You can <a href="...">tailor Boost.Build</a> for your platform," for example.
That would be good.
To prepare Unix tools such as GCC, the compiler and linker must be
Rather than "Unix" consider "*nix" to be more inclusive. Those using a *nix OS will understand. Those not using one won't care.
I have no objection. But I do want to know: what *nix OS is not a Unix OS?
<p> Note: the <b><code>#include</code> root</b> directory mentioned
s/root/<i>root</i>
What is your rationale for suggesting that change? The only possible reason I can imagine is that you're worried people will think "root" is source code text. But there's already a good hint: the change from code font. I'm pretty sure we don't want to get into using bold-italic text without a very strong motivation.
The default build and install attempts to build all available libraries and install to default locations the libraries and Boost header files.
Now you're sounding a bit like Yoda.
Yeah, I had a hard time with that one.
How about this:
The default build and install attempts to build all available ^--- "process" libraries and install the libraries and header files to default locations.
I don't like the replication of "default," but I'm not sure how to improve it at this point.
Also, there's a preposition missing before "how." How about,
If you are using an IDE, there is usually a graphical tool for specifying which directories will be searched for <code>#include<...></code>ed files.
"Graphical tool" suggests something other than a dialog or other on-screen GUI structure to me. It suggests, e.g., charting. I suggest this:
If you are using an IDE, it probably provides a means for specifying which directories will be searched for....
Better. "A means to specify" would be more natural for me.
Footnotes: [1] Depending on your installation, a Unix compiler such as GCC may have additional requirements. Check with your system administrator if you're unsure about your installation.
While correct, "you're unsure" is a bit awkward. I suggest expanding the contraction or replacing "unsure" with "not sure."
Doesn't seem awkward to me. When do you feel "unsure" is unawkward? -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> writes:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
To prepare Unix tools such as GCC, the compiler and linker must be
Rather than "Unix" consider "*nix" to be more inclusive. Those using a *nix OS will understand. Those not using one won't care.
I have no objection. But I do want to know: what *nix OS is not a Unix OS?
Linux is a prime example. "Unix" is a trade name that means something very specific. Not all Unix-like OSes are Unix.
<p> Note: the <b><code>#include</code> root</b> directory mentioned
s/root/<i>root</i>
What is your rationale for suggesting that change?
The only possible reason I can imagine is that you're worried people will think "root" is source code text. But there's already a good hint: the change from code font. I'm pretty sure we don't want to get into using bold-italic text without a very strong motivation.
I'm pretty sure that you used italics to indicate user-specific information elsewhere. (I'd had to go locate the previous message and I don't have time at the moment.) Since the root is based upon where the user unpacks the archive or installs things, it is based upon the user's system needs. Note that I was looking at the HTML source only, so your original may have been fine anyway.
The default build and install attempts to build all available libraries and install to default locations the libraries and Boost header files.
Now you're sounding a bit like Yoda.
Yeah, I had a hard time with that one.
How about this:
The default build and install attempts to build all available ^--- "process" Yes.
libraries and install the libraries and header files to default locations.
I don't like the replication of "default," but I'm not sure how to improve it at this point.
Change the second one to "standard?"
Footnotes: [1] Depending on your installation, a Unix compiler such as GCC may have additional requirements. Check with your system administrator if you're unsure about your installation.
While correct, "you're unsure" is a bit awkward. I suggest expanding the contraction or replacing "unsure" with "not sure."
Doesn't seem awkward to me. When do you feel "unsure" is unawkward?
It's not "unsure" alone that's the problem. It's the juxtaposition of "you're" and "unsure" that I was talking about. Note that one of the suggestions was to expand the contraction. -- Rob Stewart stewart@sig.com Software Engineer http://www.sig.com Susquehanna International Group, LLP using std::disclaimer;
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> wrote:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> writes:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
To prepare Unix tools such as GCC, the compiler and linker must be
Rather than "Unix" consider "*nix" to be more inclusive. Those using a *nix OS will understand. Those not using one won't care.
I have no objection. But I do want to know: what *nix OS is not a Unix OS?
Linux is a prime example. "Unix" is a trade name that means something very specific. Not all Unix-like OSes are Unix.
It says "Unix tools such as GCC". Wouldn't this apply to GCC on Linux as well?
<p> Note: the <b><code>#include</code> root</b> directory mentioned
s/root/<i>root</i>
What is your rationale for suggesting that change?
The only possible reason I can imagine is that you're worried people will think "root" is source code text. But there's already a good hint: the change from code font. I'm pretty sure we don't want to get into using bold-italic text without a very strong motivation.
I'm pretty sure that you used italics to indicate user-specific information elsewhere. [...]
That would probably be me. ISTR Dave objecting to me using italics.
[...]
BTW, I'm still with you here, although I'm pretty silent right now. This week is a very busy one again. I plan to find some time on the weekend to incorporate the changes suggested. (This also gives you a bit more time to discuss them <g> ) Schobi -- SpamTrap@gmx.de is never read I'm Schobi at suespammers dot org "Coming back to where you started is not the same as never leaving" Terry Pratchett
"Hendrik Schober" <SpamTrap@gmx.de> writes:
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> wrote:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> writes:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
To prepare Unix tools such as GCC, the compiler and linker must be
Rather than "Unix" consider "*nix" to be more inclusive. Those using a *nix OS will understand. Those not using one won't care.
I have no objection. But I do want to know: what *nix OS is not a Unix OS?
Linux is a prime example. "Unix" is a trade name that means something very specific. Not all Unix-like OSes are Unix.
It says "Unix tools such as GCC". Wouldn't this apply to GCC on Linux as well?
Yes, but technically it wouldn't apply to Intel on Linux. It won't make much difference to understandability if you reject Rob's change, but he's right that his suggestion would be an improvement. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
David Abrahams wrote:
"Hendrik Schober" <SpamTrap@gmx.de> writes:
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> wrote:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> writes:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
To prepare Unix tools such as GCC, the compiler and linker must be
Rather than "Unix" consider "*nix" to be more inclusive. Those using a *nix OS will understand. Those not using one won't care.
I have no objection. But I do want to know: what *nix OS is not a Unix OS?
Linux is a prime example. "Unix" is a trade name that means something very specific. Not all Unix-like OSes are Unix.
It says "Unix tools such as GCC". Wouldn't this apply to GCC on Linux as well?
Yes, but technically it wouldn't apply to Intel on Linux. It won't make much difference to understandability if you reject Rob's change, but he's right that his suggestion would be an improvement.
Well, GCC isn't a Unix tool. At least G in GCC acronym stands for "GNU is not a Unix" :) Andrey
Andrey Melnikov <melnikov@simplexsoft.com> writes:
David Abrahams wrote:
"Hendrik Schober" <SpamTrap@gmx.de> writes:
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> wrote:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> writes:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
>"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes: > > To prepare Unix tools such as GCC, the compiler and linker must be
Rather than "Unix" consider "*nix" to be more inclusive. Those using a *nix OS will understand. Those not using one won't care.
I have no objection. But I do want to know: what *nix OS is not a Unix OS?
Linux is a prime example. "Unix" is a trade name that means something very specific. Not all Unix-like OSes are Unix.
It says "Unix tools such as GCC". Wouldn't this apply to GCC on Linux as well?
Yes, but technically it wouldn't apply to Intel on Linux. It won't make much difference to understandability if you reject Rob's change, but he's right that his suggestion would be an improvement.
Well, GCC isn't a Unix tool. At least G in GCC acronym stands for "GNU is not a Unix" :)
Your point is lost on me; but I'm done arguing over this change. Rob's idea is an improvement, IMO. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> writes:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
Rob Stewart <stewart@sig.com> writes:
From: David Abrahams <dave@boost-consulting.com>
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
To prepare Unix tools such as GCC, the compiler and linker must be
Rather than "Unix" consider "*nix" to be more inclusive. Those using a *nix OS will understand. Those not using one won't care.
I have no objection. But I do want to know: what *nix OS is not a Unix OS?
Linux is a prime example. "Unix" is a trade name that means something very specific. Not all Unix-like OSes are Unix.
<p> Note: the <b><code>#include</code> root</b> directory mentioned
s/root/<i>root</i>
What is your rationale for suggesting that change?
The only possible reason I can imagine is that you're worried people will think "root" is source code text. But there's already a good hint: the change from code font. I'm pretty sure we don't want to get into using bold-italic text without a very strong motivation.
I'm pretty sure that you used italics to indicate user-specific information elsewhere.
No, I use it to indicate placeholder words that are designed to be replaced by the user in some larger context, e.g. The command <tt>bjam</tt> <i>target-name</i> will build the specified target.
(I'd had to go locate the previous message and I don't have time at the moment.) Since the root is based upon where the user unpacks the archive or installs things, it is based upon the user's system needs. Note that I was looking at the HTML source only, so your original may have been fine anyway.
My original was fine; italicizing is inappropriate in this context.
The default build and install attempts to build all available libraries and install to default locations the libraries and Boost header files.
Now you're sounding a bit like Yoda.
Yeah, I had a hard time with that one.
How about this:
The default build and install attempts to build all available ^--- "process" Yes.
libraries and install the libraries and header files to default locations.
I don't like the replication of "default," but I'm not sure how to improve it at this point.
Change the second one to "standard?"
Good, but I'd change the first one to standard, because otherwise the reader may think we're referring to some platform standard. Maybe true on *nix but not on Windoze.
Footnotes: [1] Depending on your installation, a Unix compiler such as GCC may have additional requirements. Check with your system administrator if you're unsure about your installation.
While correct, "you're unsure" is a bit awkward. I suggest expanding the contraction or replacing "unsure" with "not sure."
Doesn't seem awkward to me. When do you feel "unsure" is unawkward?
It's not "unsure" alone that's the problem. It's the juxtaposition of "you're" and "unsure" that I was talking about. Note that one of the suggestions was to expand the contraction.
Okay, I think I understand what you mean. "you're unsure" is a little hard to pronounce and it rhymes. Probably your suggestion is the right one. -- Dave Abrahams Boost Consulting www.boost-consulting.com
David Abrahams wrote:
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
---
Okay, I remember rewriting this sentence for you:
Most of Boost's libraries are header-only.
I suggested:
Most Boost libraries consist entirely of header files.
This sentense is one more reason for header-only package. Andrey
On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 21:11:32 +0300, Andrey Melnikov wrote
David Abrahams wrote:
"Hendrik Schober" <boost@HSchober.de> writes:
---
Okay, I remember rewriting this sentence for you:
Most of Boost's libraries are header-only.
I suggested:
Most Boost libraries consist entirely of header files.
This sentense is one more reason for header-only package.
I think the 'header' only package is a distraction from an improved packaging system. What does it achieve? Decreased size? Are you going to throw out docs? Examples? That seems doubtful. The thing is, in an uncompiled form, the compiled libraries don't really add much to the size of boost so it won't be alot of space saved. What are you going to do with date-time? In 1.33 about 95% of the library can be used header only -- only serialization and a couple other features need the lib. No, I think the real capability, if you want to reduce size, is to allow users to pick and choose only the libs they want. And, by the way, it has to be painless to upgrade with other libs as the need develops or we will just create a support mess. Jeff
participants (3)
-
Andrey Melnikov -
David Abrahams -
Hendrik Schober -
Hendrik Schober -
Jeff Garland -
Jeremy Maitin-Shepard -
Paul A Bristow -
Rene Rivera -
Rob Stewart